Posted by jromine on August 12, 2011 at 2:36pm
Hi, was there a glitch on groups.drupal.org yesterday? I ask because christefano has appeared as a group admin for the groups.drupal.org/la group http://groups.drupal.org/og/users/3002. Neither I nor Mike Stewart (the other group admin) added him. Could you please look into how this happened, remove him as a group admin, and take any reasonable steps to prevent this happening again?
Thanks,
John
Comments
Hi John, this wasn't a
Hi John, this wasn't a glitch. I added myself back as an organizer while doing a demo at a meetup yesterday on how OG on groups.drupal.org works. There are still a lot of assumptions and misunderstandings about how things work and what organizers and OG admins can do and I'm trying to answer as many questions as I can.
For anyone who isn't aware, I am an organizer in this group, have been listed as an OG admin since 2008, built all the OG Panel pages and even did a Drupal Dojo screencast about it. Due to local politics that are still under active discussion, I was removed without my permission. Whether I should continue being listed as an organizer is a matter for the LA Drupal user group to decide.
Christefano, I've removed
Christefano, I've removed your additional permissions as a "user admin" and "editor" on g.d.o. I feel it is inappropriate to use those permissions to grant admin status in a group to go around the process. Even if it was done just for demo purposes, there are other ways to demo the capabilities of OG that don't risk pissing people off.
I greatly appreciate all the many things you have done with those permissions over the years, but given the temperature of the situation in LA and this behavior I feel that this is the only appropriate action. If you would like to help as an admin of g.d.o in the future I am very open to that idea.
I'm stating this publicly because I feel it's important for folks to know that while we are happy to grant permissions to those who will help with the site, we will also remove permissions as and where appropriate if they are used improperly.
knaddison blog | Morris Animal Foundation
I was just editing my comment
I was just editing my comment when I got an error. Here's what I was saying:
(Update: John, I'm removing my name from the list pending the outcome of the discussion mentioned above. Having only two organizers listed for the entire user group isn't accurate, but listing one more doesn't really make it more accurate. The organizers list needs to reflect how things are actually done in the user group or, as greggles said today, code needs to be written to remove the group organizers block entirely.)
transcript
This discussion moved to IRC, so here's an unedited transcript:
christefano: greggles: pinggreggles: hey man
greggles: I don't have much time to talk
christefano: hey, I was just editing my comment but posted it as a new one: http://groups.drupal.org/node/168479#comment-561899
christefano: greggles: I just wanted you to know that I thought about it today and I agree with you
greggles: ok
greggles: I think when roles are revoked it regenerates your session
christefano: I think editors can edit comments regardless of replies
christefano: greggles: in response to what you said, yes I would like to be an admin in the future.
greggles: the "edit comment after a reply" feature hasn't actually worked since 4.5
greggles: rather "block editing of a comment after a reply"
greggles: but there is a comment in comment.module that says it still works
christefano: oh, hmm.
greggles: or there was as of a while ago
greggles: regardless
greggles: I am glad to hear you would like to be an admin in the future
christefano: greggles: by the way, which process are you referring to in your comment?
greggles: you know, I'm not sure there is one stated
greggles: but definitely "make yourself an admin of an arbitrary group" feels like something we shouldn't need to make a policy against
greggles: and "make yourself an admin of a group where you were explicitly removed within the last 3 months" seems even more clear
greggles: even more clear as an inappropriate action
christefano: greggles: indeed. this isn't an arbitrary group, though.
christefano: greggles: the way I was removed wasn't exactly explicit… there's a power struggle going on in the group and the "management" that there has been in the past no longer exists
greggles: 3 of the 5 people who were group organizers felt you should be removed
greggles: well
greggles: 4 of the 5 people who were group organizers felt you should be removed
christefano: I know this is local politics stuff, but I think it needs to be pointed out that there are now 2 out of those 4 people who maintain that they are "managers" despite that it's an empty title
greggles: ok
MediaDoneRight: christefano, if you didnt have a tendency to act unilaterally, we'd love to have you admin.
christefano: greggles: the power structure has changed and there is no 4-1 majority anymore. we just had a local governance meeting 2 weeks ago and 4 people said that they'd like to be listed as organizers, all of whom John and I know and trust
christefano: however, if they were OG admins of the group they wanted to be listed as "moderators" or not be listed at all.
MediaDoneRight: christefano, organize meetups. enjoy.
greggles: "local governance meeting" is only tangentially related to "things I (greg) care about as a g.d.o admin"
christefano: greggles: I think it matters if you consider that the remaining power structure is not open to sharing the duties and responsibilities of maintaining or moderating the OG group
greggles: if they are derelict in their responsibilities please file issues which document it
greggles: feel free to use an issue tag so that they can easily follow/fix
christefano: greggles: their responsibilities to the OG group or the user group as a whole?
greggles: to the OG group
christefano: greggles: hmm, I can point to previous neglect but there haven't been any recently because I was always able to fix them. okay, I'll file issues if anything new comes up
christefano: I can point to previous abuse of editor rights, too, but that hasn't happened for a while.
christefano: all right, thanks for all your help, greggles
greggles: sure thing, and likewise christefano
I'm not sure why you felt it
I'm not sure why you felt it was appropriate to post this without consulting me first.
I don't take back anything I said, but without the full context of the situation some things could be interpreted incorrectly.
The biggest example of something that could be taken out of context is that in spite of what I said in irc I do generally care about the health of local Drupal communities and specifically the LA Drupal community. In this exact moment, with a fair bit of additional work being created for me because of policitics and personality conflicts in the LA Drupal group, I am frustrated and so I said I didn't care about it in my role as a g.d.o admin.
In short: greggles <3 LA Drupal (in general).
knaddison blog | Morris Animal Foundation
Sorry for not consulting you
Sorry for not consulting you about that. I didn't realize that I should have. The conversation continued in a public channel and my intention was to connect the different parts of it for the sake of continuity.
I also expect other people who were in the channel at the time to send the transcript to others. I posted it here to save them the time and because they've edited my messages in the past and I wanted my words to be here in unedited form.
Although I understood what you meant on IRC, I didn't stop to consider that others would take your words out of context. Thanks for clarifying in your comment above, but I for one have never thought or said that you don't care and wouldn't want others to think that. Again, I'm sorry about that.