Handling job postings with no specified location

Senpai's picture

Thinking about ways to deal with job postings that declare "no remote workers" but then fail to indicate where in the world they need the prospective employees to live.

A) I've tried commenting on the post to get the poster to edit their original job posting, and then removing the comment once they do, but that's only worked in about 65% of cases, I'd guess? @sreynan told me that he thinks that's a bad method or approach.

B) We could add a text field for "location of job:". Even make it only appear if the 'remote-workers' setting is disallowed. But this would seem to be a fairly involved data approach for something that's not a systemic problem in the first place?

C) We could send the original poster a private message informing them about the problem. This method doesn't inform any of the other moderators that anything's been done about it, and they're likely to get deluged with private emails?

Any other thoughts, ideas, solutions to this problem?

Comments

d) Ignore it?

sreynen's picture

Keep in mind that jobs are going away on groups.drupal.org soonish, at which point this will be irrelevant for Groups. See:

https://assoc.drupal.org/content/drupal-job-board-will-be-built

But if we want to discuss the problem to help the Association prepare, my opinion is that communication around job posts should stay between the hiring organization and candidates. If you're interested in a job and can't tell where the location is from the post, ask the hiring organization. If you're not interested in the job, don't worry about it. Job posts are not a community collaboration, which is part of why we're moving them off Groups.

Understood that the group

Senpai's picture

Understood that the group postings are going away "soonish", meaning anywhere from one month to 1.6 years, the latter of which is the approximate time I feel like I've been battling these useless job postings. :)

Yes, they're not prevalent nor pervasive like a spam comment bot problem might be, but that doesn't make them any less of a black hole in groups.drupal.org. We have thousands of readers in as many different groups, and every time a job posting is slung out there which states, in effect, "You have to live/move to right here or we won't hire you". But then they don't actually say which country, state, city, town, burg, etc, but you're suggesting that the thousands of readers who might be potential applicants should just contact the company directly? Even when the only contact information on their posting is a link to their bloody application form?

I just don't see how us enabling job posters to waste thousands of reader's time by simply ignoring their laziness for another $1.6 years benefits the members of g.d.o. No, ignoring it completely is by far the lowest priority solution, in my opinion.

E) What if we simply unpublish a job posting that demands a location but doesn't specify one? The author would still be able to see it, right? And the content wouldn't become lost, since all it really needs is a minor tweak before it can be republished...


Joel Farris | my 'certified to rock' score
Transparatech
http://transparatech.com
619.717.2805

The new jobs platform is in

greggles's picture

The new jobs platform is in QA and nearly launched at Austin so I don't think it's 1.6 years away.

I agree with sreynen on this one. There are a large number of elements that are missing from many g.d.o job posts that I find important, but I don't see a big need to go around policing that.

If there is a broad consensus that the lack of a geographic marker on the job makes these posts useless then I wouldn't block adding it, but I haven't heard a minority stating that perspective, much less a broad consensus.

Oh, that's great news about

Senpai's picture

Oh, that's great news about the jobs system! I'm still catching up on the new user profiles system that's in QA right now. :)

I'm not so much inquiring here about what everyone should do about this problem as much as I'm inquiring as to why the method that I've been using for years to try and combat this problem is only now being called into question as illegitimate, and I'm seeking alternate methods that will allow me to keep on policing as I have been until such a time as the job postings can go away for good.


Joel Farris | my 'certified to rock' score
Transparatech
http://transparatech.com
619.717.2805

You said that you add

greggles's picture

You said that you add comments to job posts, but comments are not enabled by default. Have you been enabling comments and then commenting? In my opinion that would be inappropriate to do that.

Yes

sreynen's picture

Yes, I think applicants who want more information about a job should ask employers directly, regardless of how many applicants there are. If the employer hasn't made that easy, that's their choice. Ultimately employers can and will waste applicants' time in many different ways. In that sense, it is somewhat similar to spam.

One place it differs from spam is applicants are actively opting into the process and can opt out at any point. If an employer is wasting your time, you can stop reading what they post. If job posts in general are wasting your time, you can unsubscribe from them entirely. If we could similarly opt out of spam, it would be a non-issue.

Job posts also differ from spam in being complicated to moderate. Spam is generally very easy to identify, but identifying an incomplete job post requires knowledge of the employer and their motivations that we don't have. Joel seems to be thinking that no remote work means the employer has a specific location required, but it doesn't always. The company whose job posts prompted this discussion has offices in at least 3 different cities, so there's a good chance they don't require a specific location, only that someone work on site somewhere they have an office. They may even be looking to open a new office wherever they can find enough good applicants. That would still be non-remote work, but they wouldn't have a location to mention. Or maybe they already have new office locations they would prefer not to publicize to anyone other than applicants. Or maybe they just forgot to mention location. Or maybe they specifically wanted applicants who are willing to move anywhere for the right job. We don't know.

And I don't think we, as moderators, should be involved in finding out. There's almost never any conflict of interest with spam, but there's a huge potential conflict of interest on job posts. It's very hard for moderators to both remain and appear impartial, as there's a very good chance we're either trying to hire the same candidates or applying for the same jobs.

This problem has been solved

Senpai's picture

This problem has been elegantly solved on the news jobs.drupal.org subsite, so this is now a non-issue.

Marking this as #closed. ;)


Joel Farris | my 'certified to rock' score
Transparatech
http://transparatech.com
619.717.2805