DrupalCamp NYC #9 registration will open Thursday, stay tuned for more info

Like Eric says, there was a lot of discussion about this, and I don't think it was exactly a clear cut preference for many folks, including myself. A number of factors led down this path, including room availability, time-frame, and notably a general sense that we're capable of putting on a variety of events with different dynamics and focus - from pre-planned camps, to long-form topic presentations (http://groups.drupal.org/node/130819), meetups, beery meetups, beers and in-between.

Me? I'm generally a fan of structured events, and the type of prep and learning they support, but I'm far from convinced that this can't be amazing in its own regard, esp. if consideration is given to the pitfalls you describe.

Jen, I was kind of floored by your declaration that this shouldn't be called DrupalCamp. Firstly, I don't think that a DrupalCamp necessarily needs to be any one thing other than a camp or gathering about Drupal. But moreover, I've always understood DrupalCamps to be so named because they're in the same vein as BarCamps and other unconferences. See https://secure.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/wiki/BarCamp and http://sf2010.drupal.org/community/news/unconference-work-progress for examples of this strong link between the *Camp concept and unconferences. I don't think a debate about what the name "DrupalCamp" truly means or should signify is terribly useful, but if such a debate were to occur, I'd think that the history of *Camps strongly points towards the unconference format.

You wrote "I thought we'd evolved past the unconference format." Evolution is a tremendously subjective concept. Some people think that things like advanced weapons technology and the gentrification of low-income/predominantly people of color neighborhoods are examples of evolution, too. Those are extreme examples, but they're meant to be to demonstrate that one person's evolution is another person's devolution. "Evolution" often means that certain people, who tend to ALREADY have a fair amount of privilege, get to benefit from said "evolution" while others are pushed out, deprioritized, ignored, or silenced.

To me, the movement in the larger Drupal community towards a more "polished," "professional" image and presentation goes hand in hand with greater importance given to big money, business, and large corporations. That excludes me both personally and professionally as someone who is not a part of those worlds and who makes my living with Drupal working for nonprofit social change organizations that have very little money. I usually feel somewhat alienated at the more "polished" events, but I acknowledge that there's room for them and I usually get something out of them despite that feeling of being in a very weird, alien environment.

What I don't like is the implication that there is no room for more community-driven, directly democratic, grassroots events like an unconference-style DrupalCamp in addition to the more "polished" events, which now make up more and more of the Drupal landscape. There's no shortage of "polished" Drupal events like the ones you listed. There is a growing shortage of the unconference-style events, which is why I'm excited that DrupalCamp9 will not be like that. Yes, I get a lot out of the big corporate-feeling events, but I get something very different and very important out of an unconference – a sense of true community, grassroots collaboration, collective decision making, and the ability to actively participate despite not being a Drupal superstar or big shot and despite neither being a suit nor working for suits.

Are people like me, who either prefer, enjoy, or just plain feel more at home at unconferences so unimportant that there is no room for us to plan and participate in these types of Drupal event? Or can we only do that if we don't claim the DrupalCamp name and instead choose something that designates us as "unofficial," marginal, or otherwise lesser-than? Do "business types from these big NYC corporations" need to be the people who are catered to in every Drupal event? I certainly hope not!

I also think that if the "business types from these big NYC corporations" come to a DrupalCamp clearly advertised as an unconference and are shocked by the unwashed hippie commie masses and their strange community-centric ways, then that is their bad for not reading or paying attention! If we grubby plebes are going to offend their high-class sensibilities so badly and give them such a "terrible impression of the Drupal community" they are welcome attend the DrupalCamp already being planned for later in 2011! Perhaps folks should arrange for us geeks to be locked up in a poorly-lit basement with a good supply of pizza and Mountain Dew for a LAN gaming & Magic: The Gathering party so we don't scare the corporate types and make the rest of the more respectable and socially acceptable members of the Drupal NYC community look bad.

My self-indulgent sarcasm brings me to my final point – why the geek bashing when talking about DrupalCamp on groups.drupal.org? Really?

I got into this argument on the NYC list (which I have since quit), but (at least some of the) DrupalCamps you listed are unconferences. To be sure, many unconferences do use the same old 'sticky notes on a board' method of scheduling sessions, but I think that's a result of a lack of good planning technology, rather than an inherent part of the process. The best Camps/Unconferences I've been to have been planned and scheduled before the Camp- the big differences are the ways that sessions are picked (either voting or first-come, first-served) and the ability for people to judge the usefulness of the Camp before they attend.

I think that the big issue here is that the NYC group hasn't agreed that we should be moving off of g.d.o. for any planning activities (Camps, MeetUps, or other), which was a very contentious issue in the days before COD and archiving of drupalcamp sites, since there were people w/in the NYC community that seemed to be pushing their own agenda and due to previous screw ups where community sites were lost because of Domain Name and/or server owners issues (for example, I believe we lost the old Drupal Dojo site).

I highly suggest that those who think "unconference" means "unplanned" and/or "unpolished" to read Dave Winer's excellent What is an unconference?, which gets to the heart of the matter. The core idea with an unconference is that the audience includes many more experts than could fit on a panel, and thus the conference style lecture is not really that useful unless it values everyone as a participant. That doesn't mean you can't have a slick site, with prepared presentations, but it does mean you need to prepare in a way that makes the audience an active participant.

But... if the argument is between having a slick site that allows for better planning with your run-of-the-mill conference presentations vs. having no site with a "camp" style event where all experts are expected to participate (which is the dichotomy that I take from your post), I'd gladly take the latter. Since that's not the real choice we have the option to preserve the Camp "respect and engage the experts in your audience" format while still planning/scheduling ahead, having an awesome site, creating effective marketing, etc, and that's precisely what I think we should be doing.